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	<title>Comments on: Genocide Analogies</title>
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	<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/</link>
	<description>Commentary about Zionism, anti-Zionism, antisemitism and the conflict in the Middle East</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 02:22:38 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Gaza: Nazi Analogies and More in Store at Z-Word Blog</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-2685</link>
		<dc:creator>Gaza: Nazi Analogies and More in Store at Z-Word Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Dec 2008 00:13:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-2685</guid>
		<description>[...] conceivably be said to ignore the lessons of suffering - I gave on example from central Africa here - but no-one ever says this. Why? Perhaps because the long history of western racism means that we [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] conceivably be said to ignore the lessons of suffering - I gave on example from central Africa here - but no-one ever says this. Why? Perhaps because the long history of western racism means that we [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Falk: I Was Misunderstood at Z-Word Blog</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-2564</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Falk: I Was Misunderstood at Z-Word Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Dec 2008 12:23:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-2564</guid>
		<description>[...] in order to better facilitate their eventual transportation to extermination camps; as I said in an earlier post, &#8220;the ghettos were a result of the Nazi decision to embark upon [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] in order to better facilitate their eventual transportation to extermination camps; as I said in an earlier post, &#8220;the ghettos were a result of the Nazi decision to embark upon [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: David Hirsh</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1555</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hirsh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 15:52:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1555</guid>
		<description>Here's some of my writing on the "Jews should know better" argument.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/apr/26/thejewsshouldknowbetter

Also here:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/mar/24/isisraelgoodorbad</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s some of my writing on the &#8220;Jews should know better&#8221; argument.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/apr/26/thejewsshouldknowbetter" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/apr/26/thejewsshouldknowbetter</a></p>
<p>Also here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/mar/24/isisraelgoodorbad" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/mar/24/isisraelgoodorbad</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1553</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 13:38:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1553</guid>
		<description>Ah! Got it and duly fixed - thanks, Shriber!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah! Got it and duly fixed - thanks, Shriber!</p>
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		<title>By: shriber</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1552</link>
		<dc:creator>shriber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 13:17:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1552</guid>
		<description>"“Where, precisely, does this idea that suffering creates moral sensitivity - nobility, even - come from?”

It is just an argument of convenience, of course, an expectation raised against Jews to justify blame-placing. When the issue is Palestinian brutality (or any other group du jour), the line becomes: “Oppression made them brutal. What else could you expect?”"  Paul Malin


I have always been uncomfortable with the argument that Jews should be better than other because of our history of suffering. However, to be fair the argument has often been raised by Jews themselves and even Zionist Jews. 

Here is an article in The New Republic which exemplifies such thinking:

“Victory and Sorrow by David N. Myers+”

Post Date Wednesday, October 22, 2008

http://www.tnr.com/booksarts/story.html?id=dc88024f-c1f6-47e0-b88c-58bc8983f703



Of course the fact that Zionism has had, and has such high moral expectations of themselves doesn’t make the argument any truer.

I prefer Ruth Wisse’s wise account of Jewish responsibility in her important book “Jewish And  Power:”


http://www.amazon.com/Jews-Power-Jewish-Encounters-Wisse/dp/0805242244/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&#38;s=books&#38;qid=1223385257&#38;sr=1-1

I find the demand that suffering Jews be held to a higher moral standard either masochistic (when articulated from within) or  antisemitic (when demanded from outside).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;“Where, precisely, does this idea that suffering creates moral sensitivity - nobility, even - come from?”</p>
<p>It is just an argument of convenience, of course, an expectation raised against Jews to justify blame-placing. When the issue is Palestinian brutality (or any other group du jour), the line becomes: “Oppression made them brutal. What else could you expect?”&#8221;  Paul Malin</p>
<p>I have always been uncomfortable with the argument that Jews should be better than other because of our history of suffering. However, to be fair the argument has often been raised by Jews themselves and even Zionist Jews. </p>
<p>Here is an article in The New Republic which exemplifies such thinking:</p>
<p>“Victory and Sorrow by David N. Myers+”</p>
<p>Post Date Wednesday, October 22, 2008</p>
<p><a href="http://www.tnr.com/booksarts/story.html?id=dc88024f-c1f6-47e0-b88c-58bc8983f703" rel="nofollow">http://www.tnr.com/booksarts/story.html?id=dc88024f-c1f6-47e0-b88c-58bc8983f703</a></p>
<p>Of course the fact that Zionism has had, and has such high moral expectations of themselves doesn’t make the argument any truer.</p>
<p>I prefer Ruth Wisse’s wise account of Jewish responsibility in her important book “Jewish And  Power:”</p>
<p><a href="http://www.amazon.com/Jews-Power-Jewish-Encounters-Wisse/dp/0805242244/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&amp;s=books&amp;qid=1223385257&amp;sr=1-1" rel="nofollow">http://www.amazon.com/Jews-Power-Jewish-Encounters-Wisse/dp/0805242244/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&amp;s=books&amp;qid=1223385257&amp;sr=1-1</a></p>
<p>I find the demand that suffering Jews be held to a higher moral standard either masochistic (when articulated from within) or  antisemitic (when demanded from outside).</p>
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		<title>By: shriber</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1551</link>
		<dc:creator>shriber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 13:07:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1551</guid>
		<description>“Finally, and briefly, the depiction of antisemitism as tool to close down debate about Israeli policy.”

In the first sentence which is an incomplete fragment. 

Did you mean to say: Finally, and briefly, the depiction of antisemitism which is a tool to close down debate about Israeli policy?

I don't mean  to be picky, but I got lost reading it and had to guess at the meaning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“Finally, and briefly, the depiction of antisemitism as tool to close down debate about Israeli policy.”</p>
<p>In the first sentence which is an incomplete fragment. </p>
<p>Did you mean to say: Finally, and briefly, the depiction of antisemitism which is a tool to close down debate about Israeli policy?</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t mean  to be picky, but I got lost reading it and had to guess at the meaning.</p>
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		<title>By: Fabian from Israel</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1546</link>
		<dc:creator>Fabian from Israel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 11:34:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1546</guid>
		<description>"It is just an argument of convenience, of course, an expectation raised against Jews to justify blame-placing. When the issue is Palestinian brutality (or any other group du jour), the line becomes: “Oppression made them brutal. What else could you expect?”"

And when it comes to Jews, the implicit argument it that the Holocaust needed to be a moral school for the leaders of the State of Israel.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It is just an argument of convenience, of course, an expectation raised against Jews to justify blame-placing. When the issue is Palestinian brutality (or any other group du jour), the line becomes: “Oppression made them brutal. What else could you expect?”&#8221;</p>
<p>And when it comes to Jews, the implicit argument it that the Holocaust needed to be a moral school for the leaders of the State of Israel.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1545</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 11:19:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1545</guid>
		<description>Shriber

Thanks for the comment. Not sure I understand what the problem with that paragraph is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shriber</p>
<p>Thanks for the comment. Not sure I understand what the problem with that paragraph is.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Malin</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1540</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Malin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 06:12:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1540</guid>
		<description>"Where, precisely, does this idea that suffering creates moral sensitivity - nobility, even - come from?"

It is just an argument of convenience, of course, an expectation raised against Jews to justify blame-placing. When the issue is Palestinian brutality (or any other group du jour), the line becomes: "Oppression made them brutal. What else could you expect?"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Where, precisely, does this idea that suffering creates moral sensitivity - nobility, even - come from?&#8221;</p>
<p>It is just an argument of convenience, of course, an expectation raised against Jews to justify blame-placing. When the issue is Palestinian brutality (or any other group du jour), the line becomes: &#8220;Oppression made them brutal. What else could you expect?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: shriber</title>
		<link>http://blog.z-word.com/2008/10/genocide-analogies/#comment-1539</link>
		<dc:creator>shriber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 22:31:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.z-word.com/?p=392#comment-1539</guid>
		<description>Ben, good argument, but you might consider revising the penultimate paragraph:

"Finally, and briefly, the depiction of antisemitism as tool to close down debate about Israeli policy. I said that was scandalous, as a cursory examination of Geras’s blog or of the Engage website amply proves. There is plenty of criticism here, much of it justified. But it is measured and proportionate."


Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben, good argument, but you might consider revising the penultimate paragraph:</p>
<p>&#8220;Finally, and briefly, the depiction of antisemitism as tool to close down debate about Israeli policy. I said that was scandalous, as a cursory examination of Geras’s blog or of the Engage website amply proves. There is plenty of criticism here, much of it justified. But it is measured and proportionate.&#8221;</p>
<p>Thanks!</p>
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